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Team: Sanktuarium
Main: Emilian
Level: 2077
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Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:00 am
Post Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength scaling down with range
I have noticed 100% analysis gives random critical strength bonus. It is nowhere close to 50% even now. For example if I get 4381 reg hit with PSS I'm getting crits like:
5082
4677
4539
etc, while msg says 150% all the time.


Last edited by Sideer on Fri Jun 03, 2011 5:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

Thu Jun 02, 2011 8:54 am
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
Sideer wrote:
I have noticed 100% analysis gives random critical strength bonus. It is nowhere close to 50% even now. For example if I get 4381 reg hit with PSS I'm getting crits like:
5082
4677
4539
etc, while msg says 150% all the time.

The faster you move the lover you hit.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:03 am
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Team: Sanktuarium
Main: Emilian
Level: 2077
Class: Shield Monkey

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:00 am
Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
My speed is at 0-2 when firing, so it is not that.


Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:07 am
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
I noticed the +crit damage isn't much more than 25% extra damage when using the show damage.

I normally get about 4000 per pss bullet on MF Reavers. With +150% more damage, I got about 4500 damage a shot at SA100. I was happy with the ROF, but I felt I should've at least do 50% more damage like all non seer classes.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:31 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
Sideer wrote:
I have noticed 100% analysis gives random critical strength bonus. It is nowhere close to 50% even now. For example if I get 4381 reg hit with PSS I'm getting crits like:
5082
4677
4539
etc, while msg says 150% all the time.


I did a ton of testing with SA in the past - different ships, different setups, different weapons, different targets - till now I never got a result like yours.

The results were, within in the limitation of rounding errors, always correct (I compare it with my sheet).


Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:58 pm
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Team: Sanktuarium
Main: Emilian
Level: 2077
Class: Shield Monkey

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:00 am
Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
With regular damage (with 100% analysis on) at 4k I should get around 10k crit on my target and I wasn't even getting the usual 50%, that is my point of making this topic. My target was Princess in UZ and those values comes from fighting her.

Edit: Was sniper analysis nerfed recently?


Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:10 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
Sideer wrote:
With regular damage (with 100% analysis on) at 4k I should get around 10k crit on my target and I wasn't even getting the usual 50%, that is my point of making this topic. My target was Princess in UZ and those values comes from fighting her.

Edit: Was sniper analysis nerfed recently?

maybe princess has crit hit resist?

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 4:18 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
that affects chance, not damage.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 4:30 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
I suggest testing on regular AI if you haven't done so already. Perhaps some bosses have a special ability (not crit hit resist) that actually reduces crit hit damage.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 4:44 pm
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Team: Sanktuarium
Main: Emilian
Level: 2077
Class: Shield Monkey

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:00 am
Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
anilv wrote:
I suggest testing on regular AI if you haven't done so already. Perhaps some bosses have a special ability (not crit hit resist) that actually reduces crit hit damage.


I've got the same result on Marcus (variable crit hit), damage should be constant at last. As far as I know there is no such thing like -crit strength ability in game.


Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:35 am
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Team: Sanktuarium
Main: Emilian
Level: 2077
Class: Shield Monkey

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:00 am
Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength Bonus
After some more testing I have found a reason. Values below are damage caused to my own base (physical dampener, no heat dampener).

Range ~150
22k crit with sniper fire, 17k crit with PSS

Range ~2000
11k crit with sniper fire, 11k crit with PSS

Regular damage constant with both weapons. I was also facing my target. After turning 180 degrees (efectively forcing projectile to travel more) I have noticed decreasing crit strength aswell.

Conclusion is: Critical Strength Modifier scales down with range which projectile has to travel to reach target


Fri Jun 03, 2011 5:23 am
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength scaling down with range
Verified with snipers on my team, also it appears this was a global change, noticing the same effects on my Gunners and Zerkers. Lots of zero damage crit hits.

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Sat Jun 04, 2011 6:47 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength scaling down with range
This change actually makes it so crit hits lower your DPS then you're are at max range... which effect much more than sniper.

However with sniper even at SA100 I was getting crits that did less damage than standard hits by about 3%. My tested average crit rate is 25% which falls about in line with the sniper increases. Given I should do 154% more damage on a crit and 1/4 shots should crit that is a net increase of DPS by 38.5%. with the new 3% loss of DPS that is a -.75% DPS decreases. Take the difference of those and you get a 39.25% DPS DECREASE in my DPS... if you want to compare this to another class... lets take bezerker for instance... it is basically like making a bezerker only able fire 3 weapons (-40% DPS) instead of 5... which I don't think any zeker in game would be ok with.

NOW.. this is a global change meaning that every class is effected the same, however, this change does not effect beam weapons, which is the primary form of DPS for: Gunners (weapon DPS not missiles which are not effected), SDs, Seers, many zerker weapons, most slave setups... basically the only class that uses ranged projectiles as their primary DPS is sniper.
ADDITIONALLY... Sniper and seer are the only two classes that have innate crit chance increases built into their classes, meaning where a SD crits 5% of the time, a sniper crits 25% of the time and a seer crits 90% of the time, making us MUCH more effected by said change.

I agree that even after several batches of nerfs to sniper gear we are still too powerful in solo play, however, I do NOT think that making crits (something that is supposed to be a boon to snipers) actually LOWER our DPS is not only illogical but flat out lazy...

And I won't even get into it here... but there are other SERIOUS issues with crits that need immediate fixing and I cannot understand why you are making changes like this when you have legitimate crit bugs to fix...

If ya'll need anything tested before implementing in the future let me know, I'm more than happy to provide a fully rounded analysis for ya!

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Sat Jun 04, 2011 7:10 pm
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Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength scaling down with range
just a few corrections, but your point still stands.

SDs do get a crit hit chance bonus:

Speedy Firing: +4% Rate of Fire, +1% Critical Hit Percentage, +1% Damage - these bonuses are scaled by your speed

also, the base crit hit chance is 1% while visible.

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Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:37 am
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Team: Traders
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Level: 2506
Class: Speed Demon

Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 6:48 am
Post Re: Sniper Analysis 150% Crit Strength scaling down with range
SimonV2 wrote:
just a few corrections, but your point still stands.

SDs do get a crit hit chance bonus:

Speedy Firing: +4% Rate of Fire, +1% Critical Hit Percentage, +1% Damage - these bonuses are scaled by your speed

also, the base crit hit chance is 1% while visible.

how do u calculate Crit hit chance?
like, 1% Base, 20% SD Skill, 10% Augs.

how do i come up with the final bonus?

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trevor54 wrote:
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Calypso wrote:
adum is the best.

Samantha is second.

Calypso is third.

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Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:40 am
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