Derp. So titans>BFD's? Yay, balance!

But see? That's EXACTLY the sort of noob mistake that another actual noob would make! It's not fair to balance AI against recurring players, because they already know all the tricks to kill them, making it seem too easy.

A good comparison would be Hues. They've got 80% resistance to everything but heat; to a noob they'll be really hard, to a player who knows their weakness they're really easy. That doesn't mean they're unbalanced, they just take a different type of statistic to beat them(mind power or something).

I think that this is a bad decision. Lower their level or raise their power, don't do both.

Lots more damage and range, sure, but why add the exp modifier, too?

New content is important, but making sure that existing content which went through several, indirect rebalanced without adjustment still works as intended is just as important



Agreed. The common belief that MF reavers are the one and only thing worth leveling off of shows that they need to be changed


It would be easy to do, but far from ideal. I have a bunch of ideas for new AI, however our current focus is the early-mid game. I wanted to introduce the MF Reaver change a lot earlier because that is, in my opinion, the AI that needs adjusting the most.


When/if that happens, a lot of AI have to be looked at, not just MF Reavers


The beef is supposed to increase their difficulty, the exp modifier is supposed to make up for the fact that they have paper shields.

Also, here's a few fun fact: Normal Reavers have an OL that increases their damage by 300%. MF Reavers have 3 lasers and (used to have) no OL. Normal Reavers get a DPS modifier of about 1.6 from their skills. MF Reavers get about 1.05-1.1. MF Reavers have a whopping 5% more shields than normal Reavers.

Anyone who still disagrees that MF Reavers needed a large buff need to find some sort of justification that the numbers say that normal Reavers are actually harder than MF Reavers

edit:

Reavers have paper thin shields and can easily be killed by very low level players* with a specialized setup. Lowering the level of MF Reavers would mean high level players don't get as much exp anymore. An exp modifier is applied after the level ratio modification. An exp modifier also means that MF Reavers give a maximum of 383 exp, which I think is appropriate.

*with the skill system that C1 uses at the moment. It is more than likely that a second change will occur once we see how players handle the increased skill costs

More than enough Exp for when I go oneshooting MF Reavers with my level 20s.

So do they still give the xp what they would normally give just capped off at that number or is it less xp and capped off at that number?

It's simply the amount you get right now (at any level) times 0.75.

Why would you nerf their exp AND beef them at the same time?


Why not just beef and wait to see how powerleveling is changed, then continue with nerfing their LEVEL instead of XP.

No question that they need to be beefed. Also no question that endgame players can find other things to level on. I just find it annoying that you're taking a source of XP away from us without adding in higher level content to fill the void. It's not exactly a picnic trying to level past 2.5k as SD, and the threat of XP penalties in C2 means that I may not be able to afford level 22 class skills when they do come out.

EDIT: Lemon makes a good point as well. If they're getting beefed as much as you say, maybe they'll be worth the XP they currently give now.

It has been said a few times but if you remove MF Reavers you remove one of the only sources of mid game levels. At about level 1k unless you are a very experienced player with a specialized leveling set-up it becomes very difficult to level. BGs are to low level and way to durable to be worth it and Pick/Forgone DGs can be rather tricky with minor rewards which will only get you to about 1300~.

Beyond that this also is a bit lame for higher end players as we really don't have much to level off as it is and removing xp from one of the more abundent AI just makes that annoyance even more of a hassel.

I like the idea of beefing MF Reavers as they are to easy but you need to fill their niche with other AI. Lower level players need more AI type to level on and high end players need higher level AI. Why we have been stuck at 2k~ for this long is beyond me but it should be apparant how silly it is when you notice the top player board is completely run by ShM.

I'm not sure why you want me to do that. Decreasing their level would shift the exp curve (=higher level guys get less exp than lower level guys), an exp modifier just flattens it a bit (=everyone gets less exp). I prefer giving everyone less exp, because it's much easier to build a specialized setup to kill MF Reavers than it is to kill any other AI.

Higher level AI will be added in the future.

I'm a bit confused right now. The whole point of this thread was to get feedback (Success!), but so far nobody asked how much I changed the MF Reavers, but instead everyone went "EXP modifier, what the FUCK you MORON".

0.75 is not much. Instead of killing 4 MF Reavers for a level, you have to kill 5.

MF Reavers are very common, easy to find, have paper thin shields and can be killed at low levels with a cheap, specialized setup. Lowering their level would penalize high level players (you get a loss less exp if you kill AI lower level than you), an exp modifier would penalize everyone the same.

Add higher level AI please.

There are very few DF400 DGs this uni.

Making it take longer to do something doesn't make it any more challenging, it just makes it more boring.

As for platties and MF stuff being a serious consideration...seriously? Platties do absolutely insane amounts of dps if you get in the way of their torps for long, and are much more tanky to boot. MF picks move fast, hit hard, and are heavily shielded. The reason MF reavers aren't as hard anymore is because there is a larger amount of 360 degree tracking weapons in the game, and their weapon doesn't freeze you up completely anymore.

Honestly, the majority of higher level AI are both annoying and boring. At least MF reavers aren't either of those, even if they are slightly easier to kill. If you dont have the tankability of a zerker, the range of a sniper, or the dodging skills of a SD, a lot of the higher level AI are damn hard, even for somewhat experienced players. Not SP alts, durrr, but for the non-hardcore players, leveling is a bloody chore and not fun at all.

I guess what I'm saying is, If you're going to go fixing one high level AI, fix them all and don't mess around.