I wouldn't tell you if I didn't know. The fact that you got different numbers than I mean you either you have not done enough extensive testing, or you're still not doing what you need to be doing.

You failed to fill variables that hugely affect how far this panther can detect you from 50 distance. Including: The quality of cloak you're using, the quality radar he is using.

Also, Vis is separate from detection now. Did I not already say this? You're saying your friend can detect you at 50 distance with an athena+ while you carry low vis gear, that's like comparing apples to oranges. Do you notice radars have both vision and detection attributes? Do you notice that cloaks affect vision and cloaking separately..?

It doesn't matter if you're 0, 1, or 50. Unless your visibility is so great that it overrides detection. That Athena+ augged friend of yours will detect you from the same distance, because detection is based off your REFLECTIVITY and panther has a set reflectivity that can only be modified by a cloak or an aug. Someone correct me if i'm wrong, these are just my best guess.

You have a small understanding of the system yet you insist things change within the game...hm...

Reguardless he see's me from 50 or 250 is completly irrelevant SD SHOULD NOT BE HARD TO SEE AT ALL!!! How about you go test that.... It should not be a challenge to see any class that does not have the bonus in there main skill nor has ANY stealth augs period. Seer and Sniper are a differnt story and those rules shouldnt apply but you keep arguing about the visability and detection system and that there are ways around it. There should not be any tricks about it, SD should be seen reguardless of gear or cloaks, unless they are augged that way and have the proper gear period. I have a small understanding that you are a fucking dipshit and I am curious of your actual character name in game since you want to keep taking shots at me on the forum.

All I can say is this. When I pvped Super Noodles I at first thought they had 2 Seers with them. In reality it was Ruin and someone else in SD Panthers with Emp Rays. How can you confuse the 2?

>Spatzz

did you test vision? neither skills nor augs seem to have any effect.
did you test pinging? it seems to give a much larger than expected bonus
are radar augs and gear intended to stack? it seems they do.

Even the lowest vis panther possible with the gear and stuff is detectable at a range way more than 50 with a athena+...unless the guy with athena+ has a really bad radar. I've tested it.

According to Jeff augs should not effect the reflectivity of a ship at all only cloaks will.

This is one of the changes which will/would/shall make stealth more reasonable.

I did not test that myself.

After speaking to several high end Speed Demons that use Stealth, we all agreed that stealth shouldnt be allowed for SD unless you use 2 Stealth augs.

SD is currently a pointless skill, wait for damage tweak, attack, retreat, and repeat.


We all also agreed that adding tons of vis to the skill "Speed Demon" would be a good idea.

The idea of adding vis for each weapon equipped seems nice. That way SDs can still make cloak travelers and scouts but soon as they toss an Emp Ray on its game! : )

>Spatzz

I 100% agree with Trevor... I think im gonna be sick

Personally . . . I think radar vision needs beefed.
A lot of stealth SDs still have 40-80 vis. If radars had visions between 10 and 20, that would mean 400-1600 detectable range.

Seers , meanwhile, mostly having 0-1 vis, would still be invisible from anything greater than 20 distance. I believe snipers are similar.

It wouldn't completely eliminate stealth SDs, but would help quite a bit, methinks.

I like Denoan's idea. 20 might be too much, but I think 7-10 would be fine.

I think the main reason DM members are complaining about stealth SDs is they are finding that their SDs are having a hard time from a couple of TFC stealth SDs.

I am not in favour of changing visability at the moment because:

Stealth is an attribute of Recon class

Stealth + speed allows a small number of characters to fight a much larger group with some chance of sucess. It comes down to skill.

Without stealth you just get swamped by superior numbers.

I agree with this to a certain extent.

If I pop a Qa aug on a panther and a cloak I would like to be stealthy, (but nowhere near as stealthy as a seer). Without a Qa aug on the panther I shouldn't be stealthy at all.

Without a speed boosting aug on a Panther (as a seer) I shouldn't be overly fast, with a speed boosting aug I should be faster (but by no means as fast as a SD)

Also there needs to be more variety in high end vis reducing augs.

Kanga

[quote="Russell"]I think the main reason DM members are complaining about stealth SDs is they are finding that their SDs are having a hard time from a couple of TFC stealth SDs.

I am not in favour of changing visability at the moment because:

Stealth is an attribute of Recon class

Stealth + speed allows a small number of characters to fight a much larger group with some chance of sucess. It comes down to skill.

Without stealth you just get swamped by superior numbers.[/quote]


LOL!!!! Someone needs to lay off the pipe, never the less I have had a long history of comments on this subject long before we decided to milk your team for GG.