Star Sonata :: View topic - AI Feedback Thread

Chaosking3 wrote:

You can do that on almost any AI.

shawn_mccall wrote:

Chaosking3 wrote:

You can do that on almost any AI.

Actually you can't because that is the only way to level with invincibility.

Chaosking3 wrote:

shawn_mccall wrote:

Chaosking3 wrote:

You can do that on almost any AI.

Actually you can't because that is the only way to level with invincibility.

I am not sure how anyone would be invincible at lvl 10000 much less 100...

shawn_mccall wrote:

Ragnarock - Nerf DPS considerably, or eliminate swarming.
Rosfire - Nerf shields or eliminate swarming.
Ampages & Voltages - Massive nerf to DPS or make them not hit with team of 40 in every galaxy.
Basils - Make the laser non-ethereal or nerf overall DPS of both weapons and remove the -speed tweak.
Bana AI - give them 70% resist to laser so they cannot be abused to level on reavers.
Condors - Agility nerf or serious weight increase will make them more fun to fight imo.
Big Greens - Nerf resistances... A lot.
Bigger Greens - Raise AI and DF level.
MF Bigger Greens - Raise levels a lot.
Platties - Raise levels.
Wattages - increase agility and speed please.
Green Battleships - Limit them to 4 fighters a minute and beef the fighters significantly so that once you kill the fighters you have some uninterupted time to fight the GB.
Prog Rosies - Slight DPS nerf to the lasers.
MF Forgones - Shield or resist nerf.

Cygnus wrote:

Lower levels dont use drones usually unless they focus on drones

shawn_mccall wrote:

Cygnus is correct, I did not write out those changes with myself in mind. I can overcome any AI in mass by slapping a few cheap augs on a new ship. However new players don't have that luxury. Go watch what happens to new players when the hit an Ampage and Voltage swarm.

In fact, I have a low level FC and yesterday I made a point of it to generate enough hate on an SR swarm that they whould attack it and I was being hit with 10k DPS from about 80 Zebus. Show me one legitimate new player who can handle that, then take into consideration that voltages and ampages are a lot stronger.

The Lost One wrote:

shawn_mccall wrote:

I agreed to the point about Voltages and Ampages, if you read my post you will see that.

The Star-Runners swarm occurs at a very low rate, and if you attack one, and get them all to attack you, that is something that might only happen once or twice in your entire time in Star Sonata.

Author:	Visorak [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
As has been said many times, BGs take far too long to kill for no gain. Basils are annoying as hell and are not worth killing.

Author:	shawn_mccall [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
Chaosking3 wrote: You can do that on almost any AI. Actually you can't because that is the only way to level with invincibility.

Author:	Battlecruiser23 [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
Suggestion: Big Green(level 700 & 900) -Big Green resist and dps is dramatically reduced = Passive -Big Green Overload(super item) adds a SSS-like effect and a PPGT-like effect to boost regen and dps up over current amount. Item has a relatively long charge period, and activates when attacked/attacking = Active -Level 900 variant just a bit more damage from the item, but is more or less the same as the 700.

Author:	Chaosking3 [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
shawn_mccall wrote: Chaosking3 wrote: You can do that on almost any AI. Actually you can't because that is the only way to level with invincibility. I am not sure how anyone would be invincible at lvl 10000 much less 100 but it is pretty simple to make say a Hotrod set-up that can kite most AI. It would probably not be to effective but you can do MF Picks at that level and indeed once I get in a Locu that is exactly what I do.

Author:	shawn_mccall [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
Chaosking3 wrote: shawn_mccall wrote: Chaosking3 wrote: You can do that on almost any AI. Actually you can't because that is the only way to level with invincibility. I am not sure how anyone would be invincible at lvl 10000 much less 100... Did you read my post at all? Bana AI have 100% resists to laser. MF Reavers only use lasers. Bana AI are radex-able. AI do not shoot pods or things they cannot see. At level 100 you can go radex bana AI and sit your ass in a DG while you arre in pod(invulnerable vs. Ai), or a stealth ship(that the AI can't see though they don't shoot), while your invincible slaves run around killing the shit out of things 20x your level.

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AI Feedback Thread http://www.starsonata.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=47750	Page 2 of 4

Author:	asassainscreed [ Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
I like the ai just the way they are.

Author:	The Lost One [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:10 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
shawn_mccall wrote: Ragnarock - Nerf DPS considerably, or eliminate swarming. Rosfire - Nerf shields or eliminate swarming. Ampages & Voltages - Massive nerf to DPS or make them not hit with team of 40 in every galaxy. Basils - Make the laser non-ethereal or nerf overall DPS of both weapons and remove the -speed tweak. Bana AI - give them 70% resist to laser so they cannot be abused to level on reavers. Condors - Agility nerf or serious weight increase will make them more fun to fight imo. Big Greens - Nerf resistances... A lot. Bigger Greens - Raise AI and DF level. MF Bigger Greens - Raise levels a lot. Platties - Raise levels. Wattages - increase agility and speed please. Green Battleships - Limit them to 4 fighters a minute and beef the fighters significantly so that once you kill the fighters you have some uninterupted time to fight the GB. Prog Rosies - Slight DPS nerf to the lasers. MF Forgones - Shield or resist nerf. A few things to point out here. Condors should stay as they are. They are nowhere near agile unless they have augmenters that give them agility or thrust. Omega Platforms should not have their levels raised. When MF Reavers are beefed, you will see a lot of Snipers doing Platforms with a Zebra Spitter from 2k range, and they have shields that reminds me of Slipstreams. Green Battleships are fine, in my opinion. Killing the fighters is done fast, and the respawn is not very fast if you kill all 4 fighters swiftly. Prog Rosies are fine as they are. They have low range, and insanely low shields. But sadly, they don't occur often enough in my opinion, or they would be great to level on for Seers, Snipers and Speed Demons. Wattages should not have any speed increase. The way they are right now, they are perfectly balanced for being done by Speed Demons, and they have a lot of variations with the augmenters they come with. Regular Bigger Greens should be left as they are. I level my level 300 characters on them with a Paximinus fleet, they don't deal major damage, nor do they have a lot of shields when you use radiation damage or mining damage. That also goes for Big Greens. Rosfires are fine in my opinion. If you dare to take on a fleet of 5-7 Rosfires (Level 65-70) you could do that with a few friends if you are level 20-30. They are great fun and just fine in my opinion. Ampages and Voltages don't have too much DPS, but the fact that they overswarm you, by having 2-3 spawn points of Voltages in galaxy, and added on 2 spawn points of Ampages makes it insanely overpowered. So this needs to be looked at, they can block people in certain galaxies for hours. Basils are fine, in my opinion. If you use items without a soul to tank their Basil Bacteria Blasters you are saved a lot, and they're shields are nothing special. These are my point of views on said AI.

Author:	Cygnus [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
@urqa Your viewpoints are tainted by having played for a significant period of time. For example; no noob would even think of using radiation damage, because just looking at them most rad weapons have terrible DPS and DPE. The number one FC user is the power leveled alt. For most players BG's are simply incredibly annoying(myself included, i admit.) In this case, it's possibly that their rad weakness is too great compared to their other resists...which was done before FC's got their big rad damage boost. Before that, they had equal resists to most everything if you scale damage across damage type, except possibly a slight weakness to mining damage. Odd that mining damage seems to be a universal weakness...why would people even develop weapons if everything is weak to their mining lasers? Derp. As for snipers doing platties, we can already do platties just as easily as we can do reavers. Honest. I was killing them since i was level 900. That's because platties are weak to snipers; on the other hand, snipers are weak versus SD ai such as condors and vultures. We could use some more of those AI, so it's cool that we're getting some. The problem with prog rosies is that the players doing them dont have a way to escape them or draw them out one by one. This is a problem with many ai, honestly; a high level knows how to get away, but a lower level will tend to, more often than not, get caught in a hail of bullets and get raped extremely quickly. Prefect example? Platties. Warp in, instant 40k damage, maybe more. For players low on money to where they have difficulty paying for gear glue, let alone a dozen vollies per level, it can be extremely overpowering. Rosfires look extremely cool...but if you see ANY honest noob attacking them, they're not just going to die, they're going to die quickly, repeatedly, and unavoidably. As for basils...again, people just dont think of these things. Lower levels dont use drones usually unless they focus on drones, and missiles are even harder to use effectively. Most people just die. The majority of the ones that survive need to think about it far too much.

Author:	shawn_mccall [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
Cygnus is correct, I did not write out those changes with myself in mind. I can overcome any AI in mass by slapping a few cheap augs on a new ship. However new players don't have that luxury. Go watch what happens to new players when the hit an Ampage and Voltage swarm. In fact, I have a low level FC and yesterday I made a point of it to generate enough hate on an SR swarm that they whould attack it and I was being hit with 10k DPS from about 80 Zebus. Show me one legitimate new player who can handle that, then take into consideration that voltages and ampages are a lot stronger.

Author:	The Lost One [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:57 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
Cygnus wrote: Lower levels dont use drones usually unless they focus on drones This sums it up pretty much for me when you write down your arguments. I have watched many low levels play, and this statement is just wrong. The amount of low levels who use drones as Fleet Commanders, Berserkers, Gunners and Shield Monkeys are insane. They take advantage of anything possible to add more DPS or HPS. Be it drones, missiles, fighters or even trans weapons, they have it. Even if they play a class that is not designed for using fighters, they use them. Same goes for drones.

Author:	The Lost One [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:01 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
shawn_mccall wrote: Cygnus is correct, I did not write out those changes with myself in mind. I can overcome any AI in mass by slapping a few cheap augs on a new ship. However new players don't have that luxury. Go watch what happens to new players when the hit an Ampage and Voltage swarm. In fact, I have a low level FC and yesterday I made a point of it to generate enough hate on an SR swarm that they whould attack it and I was being hit with 10k DPS from about 80 Zebus. Show me one legitimate new player who can handle that, then take into consideration that voltages and ampages are a lot stronger. I agreed to the point about Voltages and Ampages, if you read my post you will see that. The Star-Runners swarm occurs at a very low rate, and if you attack one, and get them all to attack you, that is something that might only happen once or twice in your entire time in Star Sonata.

Author:	shawn_mccall [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:06 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
The Lost One wrote: shawn_mccall wrote: Cygnus is correct, I did not write out those changes with myself in mind. I can overcome any AI in mass by slapping a few cheap augs on a new ship. However new players don't have that luxury. Go watch what happens to new players when the hit an Ampage and Voltage swarm. In fact, I have a low level FC and yesterday I made a point of it to generate enough hate on an SR swarm that they whould attack it and I was being hit with 10k DPS from about 80 Zebus. Show me one legitimate new player who can handle that, then take into consideration that voltages and ampages are a lot stronger. I agreed to the point about Voltages and Ampages, if you read my post you will see that. The Star-Runners swarm occurs at a very low rate, and if you attack one, and get them all to attack you, that is something that might only happen once or twice in your entire time in Star Sonata. All teamed AI have the potential to swarm though. I have run into Drops travelling in packs of threes(not fun). Whenever I find a swarm I typically kill it off for the sake of new players, but that is not something the game should rely on new players to fix. The game needs to come up with an actual solution to the problem and quit relying on endgame boredom to save the new guys.

Author:	Dorin Nube [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 5:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
At lower levels there shouldn't be any teamed AI that are aggressive. I only say this because for years we have heard that it is impossible to fix the swarms. I don't have a problem with stuff like the teamed Trader AI swarming: they never attack unless you shoot them first. So, stuff like rags should either be unteamed or unaggroed. All of the space blue ships are perfect. They look intimidating to new players, and there is a nice progression there of ships you can focus on being able to kill as you get stronger. I'd like to see more ships in that line. Like everyone else says, bigger greens and MF forgones just take ridiculously long to kill. I CAN kill full floors of MF Biggers and top level forgones, but when I see too many of them in a DG, I usually just leave rather than invest all of that time for nothing. You want a fun way to increase the difficulty of some AIs? Make some special DG areas where all of the AIs only use the highest level augs possible (within reason). For example, T20 and above AIs would only use T18 and above augs. You could increase their level a bit, but the fact that they are all using sup augs would be enough to beef them considerably. Of course the reward would be more xp and better aug drops.

Author:	ashta1989 [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
MF nephils in DGs, when u have 8 in one level they can be a pain with their pushhing out, some characters i use have an issue killing them due to this. Either nerf the push a bit or buff their damage, when i get pissed off i at least want to die at the end.

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Author:	The Lost One [ Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:39 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI Feedback Thread
They can either be really easy if you are lucky and don't get pushed out, or they can be a true pain if you have all of them managing to knock you far out. I guess they could do with a little less knockback, yes. It is the knockback, combined with critical hits that really makes it impossible to get yourself back.