I remember you being particularly vocal about the ARage/DRage debate, prom.
You're correct but I would still maintain that the ZT debate may be matter of not seeing the big picture.
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| Author: | rand4505 [ Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
Cygnus wrote: The majority is always sane. I hope you realize how completely wrong that statement it. If you don't go read a few history books. |
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| Author: | Cygnus [ Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
rand4505 wrote: Cygnus wrote: The majority is always sane. I hope you realize how completely wrong that statement it. If you don't go read a few history books. Well, it was more of an allegorical point, but...you're right, honestly. "Assuming that both sides are actually sane, the majority is always sane," just doesn't have quite the same punch. |
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| Author: | Chaosking3 [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
I have a ZT BP atm along with all the modules needed to make one. My reason for not doing so is because my only use would be as a cool travel ship. That is my applicable stance. As for the speed advantage adding that much 'power'. The Capital Ship Travel Field line pretty much poops on that idea. If you want to go fast you simply pop that sucker on and fly to your hearts content. Like it was said earlier, no one really uses Dreads/RP Ships/ZTs to tank to this added resist and dodgability thing is not all that applicable to any sort of squad run. On top of that, how many AI actually use mining damage? I personally don't really plan my set-ups around pvp, I mainly look at the PvAI side of things and in that sense I don't care to much about mining, that advantage offers me no real bonus. The ZT is simply a super super super expensive Dread. The RP ships are way cheaper and, very arguably, more effective, this just rubs wrong as the Oly ships are also harder to get uber wise. Pos Wave has a very nice niche as a sniper and tank ship, HM is insanely powerful for ShM/Engi/any other class~ and Ares War Chariot is the current pinnacle for SD/Seer till AHermes is mainstream. The ZT however is simply one ugly child. No real advantage to using one. It does not really matter what the balance sheets say. If the general population views something as inadequate and does not use that item is therefore, inadequate. I would suggest a change even if it means altering some current stats to shoehorn in some useful ones but making it obviously better then an RP ship or even, heck, a Dread, would be great. |
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| Author: | biggee531 [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
Chaosking3 wrote: ... You're asking for a linear, 100% upgrade from prior ship lines. That isn't how SS works unfortunately. When a new ship is designed, they aren't generally meant to be direct upgrades; they will augment a particular play-style or fill a niche role. The ZT is godly in pvp, a lot in part due to the nice speed upgrade and overall solid resists. |
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| Author: | seanla4350 [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
And then it would actually be useful as well if it had a Zeus Thunder and had inbuilt fighters that used some other items than Zeus Bolts and Lion Incinerators! |
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| Author: | anilv [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
Spatzz, remember when ARage aug first went in? It was panned for being a downgrade from DRage. The player base is not always right about balance... |
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| Author: | andezrhode3 [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
anilv wrote: Spatzz, remember when ARage aug first went in? It was panned for being a downgrade from DRage. The player base is not always right about balance... Put incorrectly dude. The player base does not always see the big picture, would be much more accurate for the above comparison. |
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| Author: | anilv [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
I remember you being particularly vocal about the ARage/DRage debate, prom. You're correct but I would still maintain that the ZT debate may be matter of not seeing the big picture. |
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| Author: | andezrhode3 [ Fri Feb 03, 2012 8:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
anilv wrote: I remember you being particularly vocal about the ARage/DRage debate, prom. You're correct but I would still maintain that the ZT debate may be matter of not seeing the big picture. I don't remember, but it sounds like the kind of thing I'd throw my hat into. And I agree entirely, thats why I said "For the above comparison". |
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| Author: | Chaosking3 [ Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
That argument is flawed though. At the time the DRage was in fact better due to all ubers only taking bank. Back to the simple statistics of only 4 active ZT. |
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| Author: | The Salty One [ Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
I had a big spam post to make here comparing (as a FC) the EFDN, RP carrier and ZT... I decided that the ZT isn't 88% better (in most cases I'd go for the carrier) and that it looked bitchy, so I post this instead: tl;dr: It's meant to be used via both classes, yet everything about the darned thing says 'for best results apply gunner and wait until beefed'. The inbuilt supers need to be made useful for both classes... is it possible to have a super/item that boosts the power of missiles/auras/fighters for either Fleet Commander OR Gunner, not both at once? |
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| Author: | saran [ Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
The Salty One wrote: I had a big spam post to make here comparing (as a FC) the EFDN, RP carrier and ZT... I decided that the ZT isn't 88% better (in most cases I'd go for the carrier) and that it looked bitchy, so I post this instead: tl;dr: It's meant to be used via both classes, yet everything about the darned thing says 'for best results apply gunner and wait until beefed'. The inbuilt supers need to be made useful for both classes... is it possible to have a super/item that boosts the power of missiles/auras/fighters for either Fleet Commander OR Gunner, not both at once? See I would be a lot happier if it at least had SSS worth shit..the fighters are meh...and the missiles... just a waste. Though I dont know that id want a built in aura.. If admins ever decide to add more auras (possibly some T21 ones?) FC would be at a disadvantage using it. Though some combat SSS's would be cool, maybe one could be like an aura that works like a tweak. a Cooldown period and a way to hotkey activate it for X period of time. |
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| Author: | Chaosking3 [ Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
saran wrote: The Salty One wrote: I had a big spam post to make here comparing (as a FC) the EFDN, RP carrier and ZT... I decided that the ZT isn't 88% better (in most cases I'd go for the carrier) and that it looked bitchy, so I post this instead: tl;dr: It's meant to be used via both classes, yet everything about the darned thing says 'for best results apply gunner and wait until beefed'. The inbuilt supers need to be made useful for both classes... is it possible to have a super/item that boosts the power of missiles/auras/fighters for either Fleet Commander OR Gunner, not both at once? See I would be a lot happier if it at least had SSS worth shit..the fighters are meh...and the missiles... just a waste. Though I dont know that id want a built in aura.. If admins ever decide to add more auras (possibly some T21 ones?) FC would be at a disadvantage using it. Though some combat SSS's would be cool, maybe one could be like an aura that works like a tweak. a Cooldown period and a way to hotkey activate it for X period of time. Simply brilliant. |
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| Author: | seanla4350 [ Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
A super powerful version of the Gamma Emitter! |
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| Author: | Chaosking3 [ Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zeus Throne |
A burst aura to make them useful on runs would prob be a good idea. Maybe a short term high +resist or +shield regen aura. Something that can have a very large effect on a squad run and make bringing a Throne along a brilliant idea. |
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